tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5687347459208158501.post1602797072108030405..comments2024-03-28T06:07:03.667-04:00Comments on The Philosopher's Stone: LITERARY REFLECTIONS ON A COLD MORNINGRobert Paul Wolffhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11970360952872431856noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5687347459208158501.post-70922974652978273682015-02-18T22:56:17.883-05:002015-02-18T22:56:17.883-05:00Professor, the translation of the Gorgias I have t...Professor, the translation of the Gorgias I have transposes "things" and "way" in the exchange between Callicles and Socrates. What gives?mikhailhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06664753554700951922noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5687347459208158501.post-53269128093436810712015-02-16T09:08:06.288-05:002015-02-16T09:08:06.288-05:00WallyVer, I dom not know the Melzaer boomk, I am a...WallyVer, I dom not know the Melzaer boomk, I am afraid. The business about the 1859 Preface is, I think, wildly implausible. It would be really hard to argue that Marx was trying to conceal the theme of class struggle or class conflict in his writings! That strikes me as being what the English used to call "silly clever."Robert Paul Wolffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11970360952872431856noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5687347459208158501.post-50527925270302007962015-02-16T09:05:20.397-05:002015-02-16T09:05:20.397-05:00Well, if you do not feel comfortable with the phra...Well, if you do not feel comfortable with the phrase "moral truth," what do you suppose Socrates is saying in that passage? Even without knowing Gr eek, which is of course a serious impediment, I feel confident that Plato had in mind something reasonably significant in that passage.Robert Paul Wolffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11970360952872431856noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5687347459208158501.post-4554990693305165212015-02-16T08:27:55.043-05:002015-02-16T08:27:55.043-05:00To be fair, you may only have in mind the differen...To be fair, you may only have in mind the difference between Soc. and Plato--that it was only the latter who thought about metaphysics and epistemology. Yet, while acknowledging the legitimacy of that distinction, I still feel a nervousness when anyone speaks of moral truth in the context of discussing Socrates or Plato. It is too easy to import expectations about the nature of moral motivation and, ultimately, to downgrade and distort the claim that all desire is for The Good. I feel that way about otherwise diligent commentators. There is no easy line between interpretation as elaboration and interpretation as imposition. Yet, I do feel that it is easy to bring to Plato notions which are ours, not his.....whether or not you have just done that...........formerly a wage slavehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16064562730082906589noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5687347459208158501.post-39661995476094881002015-02-16T07:28:25.217-05:002015-02-16T07:28:25.217-05:00To my ears your words 'moral truth' sounds...To my ears your words 'moral truth' sounds terribly un-Socratic, suggesting a Kantian distinction between moral and other truths. It is helpful to recall the famous tendency S. had to bring up ordinary crafts, as if whatever applied there applied elsewhere. (And, there, as well, his interlocutors complained.)formerly a wage slavehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16064562730082906589noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5687347459208158501.post-38175159981163666232015-02-16T06:58:01.659-05:002015-02-16T06:58:01.659-05:00Have you seen or heard of the recent book by Arthu...Have you seen or heard of the recent book by Arthur Melzer, "Philosophy Between the Lines: The Lost History of Esoteric Writing”, reviewed for example at <br />http://ndpr.nd.edu/news/53333-philosophy-between-the-lines-the-lost-history-of-esoteric-writing/<br /><br />Melzer attempts to substantiate the frequency of esoteric writing in philosophy before the 19th century via detailed examples, and also gives a “beginner’s guide” for reading philosophy. He classifies motives for esoteric writing into defensive, pedagogical, political and protective. <br /><br />I don’t think one needs to buy the whole Strauss package in order to wonder about this issue. At the other extreme of drinking the undiluted Koolaid, though, there must be the risk of letting any assertion about a text be defended against counterexamples by merely claiming that esoteric writing is present. <br /><br />This may even apply to Marx; I’ve heard seminar comments that the absence in the 1859 Preface of an explicit focus on “class conflict” (as distinct from the vaguer conflict between forces and relations of production) had a similar motivation.wallyverrhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18358344785499490511noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5687347459208158501.post-6898394566427667552015-02-15T19:52:48.790-05:002015-02-15T19:52:48.790-05:00On Plato's literary style, I wonder if you'...On Plato's literary style, I wonder if you've read Nehamas' <i>The Art of Living</i>. Briefly, Nehamas spends the first three chapter arguing that Plato uses irony in various ways; one particularly awesomely brilliant way is that he has Socrates use irony to run rings around his interlocutors, but in so doing is <i>himself</i> running rings around his commentators. That is to say, while Socrates is using irony to cruelly mock his interlocutors, Plato is using the same irony to cruelly mock us - even as we laugh 'with' Plato and 'at' those interlocutors whose naivety Plato is through Socrates mocking!<br /><br />Nehamas claims - and given his erudition I believe him - that the critical tradition has, in two and a half thousand years, singularly failed to notice that they are been mocked as if they were dunderheaded Athenian statesmen. Now if that doesn't make you feel small...James Camien McGuigganhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08323424421768387480noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5687347459208158501.post-80971998523493577572015-02-15T19:37:53.136-05:002015-02-15T19:37:53.136-05:00Bravo, Jerry. nolite perturbare circulos meos.Bravo, Jerry. nolite perturbare circulos meos.Robert Paul Wolffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11970360952872431856noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5687347459208158501.post-68639930632931159112015-02-15T15:06:35.857-05:002015-02-15T15:06:35.857-05:00Just love it. Brilliant. The aesthetic rules! And ...Just love it. Brilliant. The aesthetic rules! And do not disturb my circles.Jerry Fresiahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01427077490696059928noreply@blogger.com